victorfirst wrote:Can i ask when we will see Mcdonalds selling Dexter burgers?. Bit off the point but AA cows were not popular until they were marketed and made commercial. Push the low input higher return argument especially as feed price and grass become harder to get. Look at our weather now, how much must it cost to keep feeding those high input cattle in houses?? Makes it alot harder to make money
If you got a couple of commercial breeders would that not help
WE NEED HELP FROM DRAGONS DEN
The 'Angus burgers' are crosses though, with Angus bulls on dairy cows, which is precisely the problem Robin is citing in Dexters. If Dexter beef was marketed more this is exactly what you happen with Dexters - there'd be a better trade for bulls and semen, but only a limited effect for females and the breed as a whole. However, I'm of the opinion that this would be a good thing for the breed overall, as it would give it commercial value, which it lacks at present. Having said that, it does now have a lot more commercial respect than it did 10 years ago.
The Dragon's would just tell us to go away and do something a lot easier that makes more money, though...
No matter how good the product is there is a limit to what people will pay. the wagyu thing is a trend its sold to up market restaurants and delis. try that with dexter and we will alienate most of our customers straight away. it has to be a similsr price to other top quality beef plus 10-15% you might get away with.
i absolutely believe that a major company using cross dexter would do no harm and only help to promote the breed. it will never happen dont kid yourselves. there is not the supply.
but hell if tesco want to use 2500 angus cattle a week!! how could that be a bad thing for angus cattle? cross bred or not.
come on mcdonalds try a dexter.
lb for £, I think they're about the same cost as larger breeds, when you factor in the cost of killing, extra fencing, feeder space etc, it all cancels out the advantages.
For me the advantages are practical - smaller joints suit the modern household better, you can keep more on the hoof, easier to transport, easier to handle (as in less likely to do as much damage if they stand on your foot). Oh, and I like 'em.
as a comparison between dexters and larger commercial breeds we have no where near the outlay on buildings and cattle race that the farm a friend of mine works for has.
he currently has a yard full of silage so i am guessing that again this year his boss has decided that commercial steers are too expensive to buy in to fatten over winter.
Humberdale Dexters (31319)
Holderness
East Yorkshire
SteveM wrote:as a comparison between dexters and larger commercial breeds we have no where near the outlay on buildings and cattle race that the farm a friend of mine works for has.
Is that a fair comparison though? I mean stocking rates & scale. Could it be that the Dexters don't generate enough income to justify improved handling and housing facilities, and if you scaled up the Dexter enterprise to the same kg's produced, would you need similar investments in facilities?
I've always managed for years without a crush and old buildings, but that was fairly small scale and relatively inefficient, so arguably I could have managed a similar weight of larger breeds in the same way.
domsmith wrote:
The reason why dexter cattle are sold at low prices is because they are not commercial cattle. It does not matter what anyone says about making a living from them or not, the buyers of commercial cattle will not buy them.
until you address that then there is little bottom to the market, so they will continue to trade low.
dominic
Until a commercial outlet is made available then prices are not going to improve. The tendency for Dexter beef to be sold by the individual direct to the consumer is not always helpful to the breed. Family and friends expect ‘favours’ they would not go into a high street butcher and expect the same. The small carcase size makes it ideal for the ‘illicit trade’. I would like to see the DCS conducting more rigorous checks before handing out stickers to members.
Prices will improve when breeders scale back their production to the market they have available. As long as they keep churning out youngstock to an uncertain market then the prices will always be low, as it is a buyers market.
Personally I think going for the 'high end' market is doomed to fail, as it will always ensure that the market is niche, as Dom says above. The Dexter needs to be as efficient and productive, weight for weight, as larger breeds. The disadvantage most Dexter breeders have is their lack of scale, but this can be overcome with communication and collaboration between breeders. At the moment we have breeders competing to supply a limited market and higher prices will only come from working together to develop and target the mass market.
I agree with Jac. We need some commercial dexter farmers. As a novice i dont understand why some people seem to fear commercial stock. Aberdeen angus were a rare breed not long ago, now as i said earlier even Mcdonalds are pushing it. There surely has to be room for commercial and true pedigree stock
Rob R wrote:Prices will improve when breeders scale back their production to the market they have available. As long as they keep churning out youngstock to an uncertain market then the prices will always be low, as it is a buyers market.
Yes, this is the problem. The breed attracts people whose main purpose is that of breeding Dexters for breeding purposes. Others have been swayed by the hype associated with Dexter beef and believe that everyone will beat a path to their door adding to the problem. Unless a good commercial outlet is developed then breeders will have to downsize their operations to suit market conditions. You can achieve a situation where demand exceeds supply but you have to stick with it and work your socks off.
victorfirst wrote:I agree with Jac. We need some commercial dexter farmers. As a novice i dont understand why some people seem to fear commercial stock. Aberdeen angus were a rare breed not long ago, now as i said earlier even Mcdonalds are pushing it. There surely has to be room for commercial and true pedigree stock
When were Angus' a rare breed? Apart from the current original population, I mean.
I'm going to mount a Shetland pony here. The problem I have with Robin's proposition is that it commodifies Dexter as a product, beef, rather than showing interest in Dexters as individual animals within a breed, which should be multipurpose.
If you read Beef by Andrew Rimas & Evan Fraser, you will see how late C18-C20th concepts of commoditisation within economic theory caused the wave of extinction of traditional native breeds.
When I got my first Dexter, the breed was still officially classed as rare. I do not wish to see a return to that status. The strength of the breed is the diversity of uses it can fulfil and so the diversity of people keeping the cattle and maintaining this biodiversity. This would be lost if a commercial beef straitjacket were to be applied.
I have no intention of keeping Dexters to make money, the past 28 years have demonstrated that admirably. What I do have is an unparalleled research resource, which money could not buy.
If I wanted to produce "commercial beef", I would be double suckling bought in calves on the Dexter cows.
My natural inclination is towards dairy, and I have good intentions of taking up cheese making again this year. What I am actively doing is preparing a heifer to be a hand-milked house cow for future sale. This appears to be a significant gap in the market at the moment. Since I've been getting a steady trickle of enquiries for house cows, it seems a good idea to address the demand. For my herd and situation, this is a far more practical route to adding value than attempting to produce "commercial beef".
I do, however, look forward to seeing Robin entering a Dexter bull at the Stirling bull sales.
Despite being a 'commercial' person, I have to agree with Louisa - I am producing beef for a living, but I'm not looking to make the Dexter bigger but to make it more efficient and consistent. At the moment the Dexter produces quite a spectrum of weights up to about 240kg, but somewhere in the middle would be better for buyers to know where they stand with the breed as a 'commercial' animal, sold unseen. If I wanted to produce beef for live markets I'd just buy what live markets want - BB or Lim.
Sorry when i said about AA being rare, i might have been better saying not so popular 20 years ago. When perhaps when they were a smaller size more like dexters
I am sorry I seem to be in the minority in the hope that breeders would like more money for their pure pedigree Dexter breeding females , how silly was I ?. but reading the replays everyone is more concerned talking about the price of Dexter beef which I have no problem with and that the Dexter should be allocated to a higher level as a commercial entity which I again have no problem with .
No matter whether you wish to breed pure or commercial you still require a breeding female and I remain very adamant that we are selling ourselves and our cows short ( no pun intended ) .
However I will battle on at least in Scotland some way or another to try and increase prices by at least 20 - 25% .
Our health situation is different , we have a beef calf scheme which gives us after 30 days from birth £ 120.00 + per calf on the first 10 calves ,a great incentive if our fantastic little cow can produce on average 8 to 10 calvings in its breeding life time .
